Talk:Trautenfels Castle

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Requested move

The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: page moved. No verification that English semi-translation is actually used in English, so default to in-use name even if not English. DMacks (talk) 05:13, 6 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Trautenfels Castle → Schloss Trautenfels — Schloss Trautenfels is the name of the place and like street names or brand names should not be translated. It is also not a castle it is a palace, even by wikipedia's own article defining a Schloss in English. --Smf77 (talk) 06:26, 27 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Our Use common name policy says to use the most common name in English. We don't prefer "official" names, as a general rule. That being said, this article is lacking any real references, which makes determining the common name difficult. I'm inclined to support the proposal since the one "reference" given (in the External links section) seems to use "Schloss Trautenfels", along with the history section. The article title is actually a minor concern however, in relation to the lack of proper referencing.
— V = IR (Talk • Contribs) 17:29, 27 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Support. I have always been uncomfortable with translating "schloss" as "castle". WP:COMMONNAME only applies if that is its common name in English. With most of these "castles" I very much doubt that it is. Direct translation does not always equal common name, particularly when "schloss" does not really translate into English. What we'd normally call a castle - i.e. a medieval fortress - is usually rendered "burg" in German, not "schloss", which is usually more a mansion or palace. Since the Germans also have a separate word for "palace", this is not a satisactory translation either, and "mansion" sounds wrong, so keeping "schloss" is the best rendering. Translating into English is not always the best solution. -- Necrothesp (talk) 13:34, 28 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Oppose The preceding argument shows the perils of naming articles by Original Research; the assumption that English Castle must be a medieval pile is simply wrong. Windsor Castle is a Schloss; so is this. They are both castles in English. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 21:01, 28 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
- Not true. A few non-fortresses are indeed called "castle" in English, but not many. The vast majority are actually "house", "place" or something similar. Whereas "schloss" is the common word for such buildings in German. Your suggestion that my argument is OR is somewhat insulting, since it implies I don't know what I'm talking about. I can assure you that I do. Your response only serves to point out the perils of accusing others of OR (an acusation that flies far too freely on Wikipedia) simply to advance your own opinion. -- Necrothesp (talk) 23:04, 28 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  - Necrothesp is correct. The vast majority of Schlosser (plural) of Schloss are palaces, while a castle is referred to as a Burg or sometimes a Festung here. The latter more accurately applies to fortresses in English however. Smf77 (talk) 16:38, 29 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
    - Since I said nothing about the meaning of Schloss, this must misconstrue what I said. Septentrionalis PMAnderson 21:56, 30 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
      - Windsor Castle originally was a medieval castle, which I presume is why it's still named as such. As to Trautenfels, if there is no overwhelming English usage that has it as "Castle", I see no reason why we should adopt such a name.--Kotniski (talk) 08:23, 4 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page. No further edits should be made to this section.

Good day. To whow it my concern

Do you perhaps have any detail on the youth leader Toni Stocker (10 July- 23 July1955) or any relatives.He was a youth laeder at Trautenfels Castel at that time.

Regards Mrs JG Meyer